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# VOM and Krishnamurti, I thought this would interest the group.

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- Subject: VOM and Krishnamurti, I thought this would interest the group.
- From: "sokan108" <carpediem108@...>
- Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 16:01:22 -0000
- User-agent: eGroups-EW/0.82

    A Brief Introduction To The Work Of Krishnamurti
    BY PROFESSOR DAVID BOHM

    My first acquaintance with Krishnamurti's work was in 1959 when I
    read his book "First and Last Freedom." What particularly aroused my
    interest was his deep insight into the question of the observer and
    the observed. This question had long been close to the centre of my
    own work, as a theoretical physicist, who was primarily interested in
    the meaning of the quantum theory. In this theory, for the first time
    in the development of physics, the notion that these two cannot be
    separated has been put forth as necessary for the understanding of
    the fundamental laws of matter in general. Because of this, as well
    as because the book contained many other deep insights I felt that it
    was urgent for me to talk with Krishnamurti directly and personally
    as soon as possible. And when I first met him on one of his visits to
    London, I was struck by the great ease of communication with him,
    which was made possible by the intense energy with which he listened
    and by the freedom from self-protective reservations and barriers
    with which he responded to what I had to say. As a person who works
    in science I felt completely at home with this sort of response,
    because it was in essence of the same quality as that which I had met
    in these contacts with other scientists with whom there had been a
    very close meeting of minds. And here, I think especially of Einstein
    who showed a similar intensity and absence of barrier in a number of
    discussions that took place between him and me. After this, I began
    to meet Krishnamurti regularly and to discuss with him whenever he
    came to London.

    We began an association which has since then become closer as I
    became interested in the schools, which were set up through his
    initiative. In these discussions, we went quite deeply into many
    questions which concerned me in my scientific work. We probed into
    the nature of space and time, and of the universal, both with regard
    to external nature and with regard to mind. But then, we went on to
    consider the general disorder and confusion that pervades the
    consciousness of mankind. It is here that I encountered what I feel
    to be Krishnamurti's major discovery. What he was seriously proposing
    is that all this disorder, which is the root cause of such widespread
    sorrow and misery, and which prevents human beings from properly
    working together, has its root in the fact that we are ignorant of
    the general nature of our own processes of thought. Or to put it
    differently it may be said that we do not see what is actually
    happening, when we are engaged in the activity of thinking. Through
    close attention to and observation of this activity of thought,
    Krishnamurti feels that he directly perceives that thought is a
    material process, which is going on inside of the human being in the
    brain and nervous system as a whole.

    Ordinarily, we tend to be aware mainly of the content of this thought
    rather than of how it actually takes place. One can illustrate this
    point by considering what happens when one is reading a book.
    Usually, one is attentive almost entirely to the meaning of what is
    being read. However, one can also be aware of the book itself, of its
    constitution as made up out of pages that can be turned, of the
    printed words and of the ink, of the fabric of the paper, etc.
    Similarly, we may be aware of the actual structure and function of
    the process of thought, and not merely of its content.

    How can such as awareness come about? Krishnamurti proposes that this
    requires what he calls meditation. Now the word meditation has been
    given a wide range of different and even contradictory meanings, many
    of them involving rather superficial kinds of mysticism. Krishnamurti
    has in mind a definite and clear notion when he uses this word. One
    can obtain a valuable indication of this meaning by considering the
    derivation of the word. (The roots of words, in conjunction with
    their present generally accepted meanings often yield surprising
    insight into their deeper meanings.) The English word meditation is
    based on the Latin root "med" which is, "to measure." The present
    meaning of this word is "to reflect," "to ponder" (i.e. to weigh or
    measure), and "to give close attention." Similarly the Sanskrit word
    for meditation, which is dhyana, is closely related to "dhyati,"
    meaning "to reflect." So, at this rate, to meditate would be, "to
    ponder, to reflect, while giving close attention to what is actually
    going on as one does so."

    This is perhaps what Krishnamurti means by the beginning of
    meditation. That is to say, one gives close attention to all that is
    happening in conjunction with the actual activity of thought, which
    is the underlying source of the general disorder. One does this
    without choice, without criticism, without acceptance or rejection of
    what is going on. And all of this takes place along with reflections
    on the meaning of what one is learning about the activity of thought.
    (It is perhaps rather like reading a book in which the pages have
    been scrambled up, and being intensely aware of this disorder, rather
    than just "trying to make sense" of the confused content that arises
    when one just accepts the pages as they happen to come.)

    Krishnamurti has observed that the very act of meditation will, in
    itself, bring order to the activity of thought without the
    intervention of will, choice, decision, or any other action of
    the "thinker." As such order comes, the noise and chaos which are the
    usual background of our consciousness die out, and the mind becomes
    generally silent. (Thought arises only when needed for some genuinely
    valid purpose, and then stops, until needed again.)

    In this silence, Krishnamurti says that something new and creative
    happens, something that cannot be conveyed in words, but that is of
    extraordinary significance for the whole of life. So he does not
    attempt to communicate this verbally, but rather, he asks of those
    who are interested that they explore the question of meditation
    directly for themselves, through actual attention to the nature of
    thought.

    Without attempting to probe into this deeper meaning of meditation,
    one can however say that meditation, in Krishnamurti's sense of the
    word, can bring order to our overall mental activity, and this may be
    a key factor in bringing about an end to the sorrow, the misery, the
    chaos and confusion, that have, over the ages, been the lot of
    mankind, and that are still generally continuing, without visible
    prospect of fundamental change, for the forseeable future.

    Krishnamurti's work is permeated by what may be called the essence of
    the scientific approach, when this is considered in its very highest
    and purest form. Thus, he begins from a fact, this fact about the
    nature of our thought processes. This fact is established through
    close attention, involving careful listening to the process of
    consciousness, and observing it assiduously. In this, one is
    constantly learning, and out of this learning comes insight, into the
    overall or general nature of the process of thought. This insight is
    then tested. First, one sees whether it holds together in a rational
    order. And then one sees whether it leads to order and coherence, on
    what flows out of it in life as a whole.

    Krishnamurti constantly emphasizes that he is in no sense an
    authority. He has made certain discoveries, and he is simply doing
    his best to make these discoveries accessible to all those who are
    able to listen. His work does not contain a body of doctrine, nor
    does he offer techniques or methods, for obtaining a silent mind. He
    is not aiming to set up any new system of religious belief. Rather,
    it is up to each human being to see if he can discover for himself
    that to which Krishnamurti is calling attention, and to go on from
    there to make new discoveries on his own.

    It is clear then that an introduction, such as this, can at best show
    how Krishnamurti's work has been seen by a particular person, a
    scientist, such as myself. To see in full what Krishnamurti means, it
    is necessary, of course, to go on and to read what he actually says,
    with that quality of attention to the totality of one's responses,
    inward and outward, which we have been discussing here.

    Copyright © Krishnamurti Foundation of America P.O. Box 1560, Ojai,
    CA 93023

    BIOGRAPHICAL NOTES ON DAVID BOHM

    David Bohm was for over twenty years Professor of Theoretical Physics
    at Birkbeck College, University of London. Since receiving this
    doctorate at the University of California Berkeley, he has taught and
    done research at U.C., Princeton University, University de Sao Paulo,
    Haifa and Bristol University.

    His publications include: Quantum Theory; Causality and Chance in
    Modern Physics; one chapter in Observation and Interpretation;
    Special Theory of Realitivity; and Wholeness and the Implicate Order;
    Unfolding Meaning; and various papers in Theoretical Physics, British
    Journal for Philosophy of Science, and others.

    Several of David Bohm's discussions with Krishnamurti appear in the
    following books published by Harper and Row: Truth and Actuality; The
    Wholeness of Life; The Ending of Time; The Future of Humanity. In
    addition there are audio and video tapes of some discussions.

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